Confident Eaters

Georgie: [00:00:00] If you haven't listened to the first episode with Katya, go back. Listen to Katya part one so you can get the full picture of what we're working through. Katya has been focusing on the goal of having one smoothie bowl a day, and she's experimenting with eating different foods for snacks and meals. She still is finding that it's really difficult to stop at one portion of dessert.

From what I've gotten to know about her, I think some of Katya's food obsession and trouble with ending a meal is the result of not having a lot of other joys, projects, or activities that she has fun with in her life. She also mentions in this episode that eating has been her only form of rest, so my coaching brain had made a note once we talk about food a bit, I also wanna help her become more skilled with enjoying her life and resting. Enjoy.

Welcome to the Confident Eaters Podcast, where you get proven methods to end overeating, emotional eating, and stressing about food. [00:01:00] We are heading for harmony between your body, food and feelings, hosted by me, Georgie Fear, and my team at Confident Eaters.

How was your weekend? Did you do anything?

Katya: It was great. We went to the beach as a family, which was nice. And one of my sons had a sleepover with his new little friend. So my husband took my other son out and I was so excited because normally when I'm like home alone and I get time to breathe, that tends to be a trigger for pantry raiding and

Georgie: yeah,

Katya: feeling good with food and I really enjoyed myself in other ways. So that was a big win.

Georgie: That is, that is a huge win. I know that's a, a tricky one for a lot of people.

Katya: Yeah, it's strange 'cause I know I never feel better, binging and overeating, but there's still just something that it seems to be like when I'm home alone, I just, one [00:02:00] bowl of cereal turns into two turns into three and so forth. So I was really happy to recognize that was gonna be a potential trigger and fill my time with other things. And and then it felt good to like notice and name that I made progress there. So that hopefully will encourage more of those little wins.

Georgie: Absolutely. That is excellent. I was thinking today we could talk some more about well I wanted to just sort of get an update on how things been going with the food experimentation that you've been doing.

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: And then maybe we'll talk some more about the fun filling the day up with joyful activity.

Katya: That would be great and thank you again so much for your help. It sounds so silly to be struggling with these things. I mean, wanting a smoothie and really fighting against feeling like I need that in the day, but I more I've been paying attention to it, the more I realize man, I think I really was using that as[00:03:00] a coping mechanism I guess, for a lot of years that I just didn't realize.

And I mean, I, I don't know if there's real, you're the expert, like science behind kind of being addicted to food or if that's just kinda what I hear in like YouTube, podcast, marketing stuff. But I really think that might be a thing for me.

Georgie: Yeah. It is you know, a scientifically valid thing. It tends to be misrepresented in that when people talk about food being addictive, sometimes what they say that's incorrect is that there's certain types of food that they label as addictive.

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: And usually they're like, oh, it's flour, it's salted sugar, it's fat. You know, that's what makes it addictive.

Katya: Right.

Georgie: But those Don't behave the same as like drugs of abuse do in the brain.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: They do cause some reward circuitry, but so does, you know, giving a hug.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: It's not the same. And I think when some, [00:04:00] sometimes when people say like, oh, these are, you're addicted to this, just like people abuse substances, I don't think it's fair to make that comparison.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: But it can definitely be a coping mechanism where we we develop habits that help us get by. So in terms of like behavioral addictions, like gambling

Katya: yes,

Georgie: It does seem more similar. So it's eating, that's the compulsive behavior, not necessarily the food.

Katya: Okay. And so like with the illustration of like the smoothie bowls, so I guess I just got into a pattern of behavior where that was kind of a reward that I looked forward to in my day.

And it, it's interesting, and maybe you could help me to understand this a little more, but I realized I was finding enjoyment almost as much in the, knowing it was coming and anticipation and looking forward to it, as in the time of eating it. Is that a thing or is that just?

Georgie: Mm-hmm. Yeah.

Katya: My weird brain?

Georgie: No, it absolutely [00:05:00] is. You know, a lot of people that have a very ingrained habit or sort of compulsive behavior that they're doing, despite wanting to stop doing it, there is an amount of

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Excitation with things that are even linked to it. So like the sounds, the idea of it, like imagining doing it. People who struggle with binge eating will often talk about, like, I get excited when I'm in the car, like going to the store to buy my binge foods.

Katya: Right. And I realized in the mid-morning, I would start thinking oh, this afternoon I get to have my vitamix smoothie bowl.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: And when I decided , and made the goal with you, I'm gonna have one a day, which is very reasonable and, you know I, I was like, oh, well I already had my, you know, Vitamix smoothie bowl after my workout, so I'm not having one in the afternoon. That time period of like just waiting to get to the afternoon knowing I wasn't having the smoothie [00:06:00] bowl, I realized I was looking forward to it for a lot longer than just like, enjoying it in the moment, if that makes sense.

Georgie: I imagine it's been really hard to try and only have one a day. Have you had any success there?

Katya: I have. I I know that sounds so silly.

Georgie: It doesn't. No, not at all.

Katya: That it's hard to only have one a day, but since we emailed and you said, how about having the goal of one a day? I have kind of like made that a hard line

Georgie: Okay.

Katya: For me. That is best for me and I want to do what's best. So I have only had one per day since we had that email, so

Georgie: Good!

Katya: I think that's good. But

Georgie: that is,

Katya: it's been quite a fight even though

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: It sounds so silly, and I've been trying, like we've been talking about to find other afternoon snacks that I can enjoy. And that has been good. I think what I'm realizing is just the, insane volume of those snack the [00:07:00] smoothie bowl was what I really liked.

Georgie: Sure.

Katya: So I'm struggling to find another snack that I enjoy as much because reasonable portions just feel small even though

Georgie: Sure.

Katya: They're quite reasonable.

Georgie: Yeah. I was thinking about some ideas for like, what might help because definitely the initial phase of I am deciding not to have that second smoothie bowl this is the hardest part because you create this gap, you're like, I've taken the second one out and now there's this like, afternoon gap in my life. And it's really hard to be like, I'm gonna push through this. I'm gonna find other things to put in there, and then it will get easier.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: But I understand it's not easy to set something aside that you've been using to help generate like enjoyment and positive emotions and entertainment. So I just wanna reassure you, we're going to fill that gap. You're not gonna be like, struggling to get through the afternoons for very long and definitely not forever.

Katya: Okay. I, I believe you. [00:08:00]

Georgie: Yeah. So I thought one thing that might work would be a lot of people like air popped popcorn because it

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Makes a big bowl and you can eat it one at a time and make it last a while.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: I also thought of like,

Katya: I'm gonna take notes,

Georgie: A big thing of fruit. If you were gonna make yourself a fruit platter, you could have like a nectarine, a peach. Like you can eat three or four pieces of fruit. It's not gonna hurt anybody.

Katya: You could cut up some watermelon, I love mango. You can cut up a mango and it also takes some time. So you're getting some of that process as well. I think you can also

Okay.

Georgie: Enjoy, like, cutting up the fruit for yourself and making this beautiful platter and maybe going to sit outside.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: With your fruit platter and your bowl of popcorn.

Katya: Yeah. I did like your idea of sitting outside too. I've tried that a couple days to make my snack and take it out because I felt like a change of scenery was nice and , it's, beautiful to be in the sunshine. I did like carrots and peanut butter one day.

Georgie: Mm-hmm. [00:09:00]

Katya: But I went way, way over on probably what was a reasonable serving of peanut butter. I started with, a little dish and then I went back for a few more scoops and a few more scoops and a few more scoops. So I figured,

Georgie: okay,

Katya: if I wanted to do that again, maybe I would preportion it out ahead of time. And I have been doing the mug cake too, which,

Georgie: mm-hmm. Cool.

Katya: I actually started adding as like a little dessert after my lunch. So I've been eating lunch and stopping when I'm relatively full, but having just a small like dark chocolate mug cake after, and that has been a very nice treat.

And then I don't feel like I am waiting until my afternoon snack to have something sweet. 'cause I think what I also loved about the smoothie bowl was it was chocolate and peanut butter and, you know, it was a good sweet, so I thought maybe adding a little sweet into my lunch too could help.

Georgie: Yeah. [00:10:00] Lunch, dessert. I'm a big fan of lunch dessert.

Katya: Okay. And I did I did get the Quest bars that you mentioned. I was like, a little bit nervous because I was afraid I couldn't have like a whole box in my pantry, but I put them sort of out of sight in the pantry. And I have, I have done well with having those, they just feel small compared to the smoothie bowls still.

Georgie: Sure, sure. Great. I'm glad that you've made some changes. This is, it shows how you're being open to new things.

Katya: Well, thank you for helping me. So I guess the first thing is just like committing to the decision not to have that second smoothie bowl. Do you have any tips or advice when I start to second guess that decision? Like in my right wise frame of mind, I recognize like this, for me, long term is gonna be a better thing. Just not to, to [00:11:00] be so reliant on that. But then in the moment I've felt myself waffling a little bit, I guess trying to talk myself out of that decision. What, what would you suggest in those times to solidify that if that makes sense?

Georgie: Yeah. Don't let yourself enter the debate about having a second one if your brain's like, but maybe there's a reason we can come up with, no, we're not.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Like, we're not going there. Just don't start the debate. Don't tolerate the debate. Don't participate in the debate.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: So the main thing is like, Nope, I'm not doing that. I'm not going backward. I'm looking forward. I'm looking for what new thing I'm gonna plug into the afternoon. Okay. I'm gonna have another one tomorrow morning, the smoothie bowl. But like one a day is what I'm having and I can try new things to find something else.

It's almost like you've had a breakup and you're like, you can't go back to them. You can't keep trying to call your ex like it's over. You have to find someone new.

Katya: Yeah, [00:12:00] right.

Georgie: You're not gonna go back to the smoothie bowl in the afternoon. We're gonna look for new love.

Katya: Yes, new love.

Georgie: So you can make other things that are sizable, like as I mentioned, like the air pop popcorn or like a great big platter of fruit. You can do carrots and dip and you know, as you said, it can be tricky to keep going back and getting more of the dip or the peanut butter or, but it'll come with time.

You know, it's just gonna take some practices. You're getting better it sounds like. It'll probably be helpful if we come up with, like, if we talk about a few tactics that you can use when you eat whatever you intended to and your mind is like, and now more! Go get more.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Go get seconds.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: So have you found anything successful up until now? If your brain is like, go make another mug cake. Go get seconds of that, what do you do?

Katya: Well, I have been practicing the delay in distract tactics from the group.

Georgie: Okay.

Katya: I [00:13:00] have been trying, when I sit down to eat a meal or snack to. Before I start eating, decide what I'm gonna do next. So I will sit down for, with my mug cake and say, when I finish this mug cake, no debate. I'm gonna take a 10 minute walk outside. And that

Georgie: great.

Katya: I think that has been helpful. Rather than kind of, I've noticed like when I do go back for seconds and thirds, they see it seems to be time that I'm just trying to extend the pleasure of the eating.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: So I think finding another activity that I can tell myself will be pleasurable after is what I've been trying to do.

Georgie: That's really good.

Katya: Even if I don't fully believe it. Like I feel like I'd have more pleasure having a second mug, than going for a walk. But I've just determined ahead of time, I'm just gonna go for the walk.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: And I'll feel better. I'll feel better after.

Georgie: Yeah. I mean, the way we think about those [00:14:00] temptations and urges is really powerful. So we can reframe it when our mind suggests you really want to make another one, you can reframe it or restate it as no, I don't necessarily want a second dessert.

What I want is to have continued experience of pleasure so I can get that from somewhere else as well.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: And if your mind uses the logic of, but the mug cake is way better than that other thing. You can remind yourself, but it also has a lot of costs. it can be a high pleasure, but also high cost.

It comes with the stomach ache, cost. It comes with thinking maybe I'm putting more food in my body than it needs sort of cost. That doesn't feel good.

Katya: Yeah. I listened to your podcast a few times the one on the really expensive sweater.

Georgie: That's exactly the concept. Yeah.

Katya: Yeah. I think I've listened to that probably three or four times when I feel like I need to remind myself of the costs. Yeah.

Georgie: Yeah. Like first serving of dessert, the price tag on [00:15:00] it says very little price. This is excellent. It has lots of enjoyment. It makes us feel free. It's nice to not be on a diet, so we get to eat dessert. The second serving of dessert, the cost has gone up. The second serving of dessert is like, this only tastes half as good as the first one and potentially could move us into the category where we're putting more sugar or processed food into our body than we want to. It might just, it might take you into the uncomfortable stomach bloat realm. It's just not, not as good of a bargain as the first one.

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: So you've got the 10 minute walk that works for the next thing. Have you found anything else that works as like planning something pleasant for after your meal or snack?

Katya: After dinner I've been doing the walk and then writing in my gratitude journal that has been a really enjoyable kind of evening routine. Sometimes I read with my, with my kids or we'll watch like a Netflix [00:16:00] show in the evening. I've been trying to think of other activities I might enjoy in the afternoon and I did try doing like a 10 minute yoga video one day. So that might be something I could try more of.

Georgie: How was it?

Katya: It was okay. I think what makes food an easy pleasure is that it's so easy. I mean, it's like already right there and so like getting set up and finding the video that took a little bit of time. So I think I made a little part on my back porch now where I'll keep my yoga mat and I have some videos saved, so it'll be easier for me to make that an activity next time. Lower barrier of entry, I guess.

Georgie: Yeah. Yeah. I usually tell people whatever you wanna do, make a convenient, like leave the coloring book out, leave the colored pencils on top of it. Don't put them in the laundry room closet. Leave the stuff out because we wanna use the convenience to our [00:17:00] advantage.

So making the smoothie bowl feels super easy or food feels super easy, but really you have to get out several ingredients. You have to wash the Vitamix when you're done. Like, it's not necessarily easier than like putting on a D V D or video and you're getting your yoga mat out. It's just that you're so used to it that it's

Katya: Right.

Georgie: Effortless.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: So when you've done the yoga video for like five days in a row, you're not even gonna think about, oh, where, what was the site that I go to? How do I start the player? It's, it's just gonna be effortless.

Katya: I'm trying too, to think like, how could I make my space enjoyable, like a spot I want to go to and kind of like remove myself from the kitchen table. So the walk is helpful 'cause it gets me outside. And I think moving to my little yoga corner removes me from the table. I have a, a special chair that I've been using for my gratitude journal and I put the journal right on the table [00:18:00] next to it. So I just like tear myself from the kitchen table and head to the chair and then once I'm there I feel great. It's just like removing myself from the kitchen and getting to the next spot.

Georgie: Yeah. Great. So you've got that chair and do you have a little yoga corner? Did you say it was on the porch?

Katya: Yes. I just started that this week.

Georgie: Cool, cool, cool. Did you ever do meditation or anything like that?

Katya: I haven't up to this point, but I think I might like to learn or at least start small with giving it a try.

Georgie: Mm-hmm.

Katya: I know we have talked about trying to find some more pleasurable activities to kind of put in my day. So yeah, that was on my list of things to try.

Georgie: Okay. I will send you a link to an app called Insight Timer, and it's free so you don't have to pay anything to use the courses to use, like the tracks that are on there.

And they have, you know, different guided meditations, so somebody's talking [00:19:00] to you. What makes a lot of people like not love meditations is boring. It feels really boring if you're just like, so I'm supposed to clear my mind of thoughts and then what? Like it doesn't, that doesn't sound good to me.

Katya: Right?

Georgie: But when it's got enjoyable music and it's a kind person,

Katya: okay,

Georgie: It does feel pleasant 'cause it's sort of like the, I love like relaxing and like putting on a guided meditation and I feel almost like this is a friendly person who's reminding me, look, I know stuff might be bothering you right now, but like the world is okay. You're okay. Let's just breathe together for a few minutes. And I'm like, I dunno. Some part of me just loves this. Like, I love the idea of having company. And I really just find somebody's voice to be really soothing.

Katya: Yeah, I would love to try that. Thank you.

Georgie: Yeah,

Katya: I've even found on my walks I will put in your podcast, I find your voice to be very kind and soothing so that would be cool. I would [00:20:00] like to try that with the meditation.

Georgie: Great. Okay. I'm sending you a link. It looks like it'll take you to I have a playlist, just like you can do with music. You can make a playlist for the tracks that you like. And so I have one that's called nightly routine. And so when I get in bed for the evening,

Katya: okay.

Georgie: I go to nightly routine and I just sort of pick one off of there. So that's the playlist I sent you, but there's plenty others to explore if you don't like.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: my playlist.

Katya: Thank you so much. I really appreciate that.

Georgie: You're welcome. You're welcome. I share it with a lot of people. It's nice and I think for many of us who are responsible and hardworking, and we're trying all day to do the right thing and be busy. And sometimes people that are prone to low moods or anxiety, like it can just be so nice to just stop and garden own spirit for a little while and not be,

Katya: yeah,

Georgie: doing things but like stop and like process and regulate and I find it feels like really good self-care.

Katya: Yes. I think it's been a few emails ago you mentioned [00:21:00] and it really stood out to me that it would be helpful for me to plan sometimes just like to rest kind of throughout the day.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: And I think I had been using like meals and snack time, sort of like as my built-in rest, but I've been thinking it could be good to have a built-in rest that is a non meal or snack time. So yeah.

Georgie: Yeah. So the guided meditations are perfect for that sort of thing. Like you just sit somewhere or lie on your couch and put on one of these recordings and like if you told me just sit on the couch, I'd be like, I'm bored. I can't,

Katya: yeah.

Georgie: Just, I can't just sit on my couch,

Katya: sit. Right.

Georgie: I can listen to an audio book, I can listen to something. Right. But I can't just sit on my couch. So yeah, I find the, the guided meditation is a really nice thing to do, where it is enough that it doesn't get boring to just Yes, listen to that. You can also do, like, [00:22:00] I find outdoors can be nice even if you're walking or moving or gardening. You don't have to necessarily just sit in the outdoors.

Katya: Okay. Yeah.

Georgie: But it can be nice just to sort of like rest, like I am just gonna relax for a minute and, you know, watch the birds and watch the wind move the tree branches around and

Katya: yeah,

Georgie: you may not wanna sit there and do that for an hour, but like for five minutes to just like, sit and rest can be really nice. And then there's good old naps. I love me a nap. Do you ever take a nap during the day?

Katya: I don't, maybe that's something I could try. I have a lot of trouble, like even falling asleep before bed. I think my mind is always spinning, so I don't think I've ever tried to fall asleep in the daytime, but I could give it a go.

Georgie: Mm-hmm. So you said there's some shows on Netflix that you've enjoyed.

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: What about like [00:23:00] resting on the couch and watching a show in the middle of the day?

Katya: Yes. My kids are home for from school right now in the summer, but I guess I could let them have a rest too. Yeah,

Georgie: you don't wanna model for them that they have to be 24 7 productive.

Katya: That's really true. And I think that's something I struggle with for my own self is feeling like I do need to be like productive. And that I think causes a lot of extra stress that I'm putting on myself. Like nobody else is telling me that. It's just me telling myself I feel like I need to accomplish something.

Georgie: Right, right.

Katya: So that's an area potential growth, I guess.

Georgie: Yeah. Yeah. It's nice to experience that when you just take a rest or when you spend time just being with somebody, sometimes, like if we're just with someone, a friend, a spouse, a kid, it can be easier than like feeling like I have to just sit and rest. But that you're not doing [00:24:00] anything, but you are engaging in an important, meaningful task, which is like you're accompanying somebody with some of your life.

Katya: Yeah. Yeah. So, okay.

Georgie: But you can think there's going to be like segments of our day when we wanna do stuff. We never wanna take that piece away and be completely

Katya: Right.

Georgie: Unproductive and just floating. But that's only one of our modes. There's also just resting and being, and restoring, like, you have to put the phone on the charger.

Katya: Right. I do feel,

Georgie: yeah.

Katya: I could benefit from a little charging occasionally.

Georgie: Mm-hmm. Yeah. So let yourself charge and then also think about just being with somebody, sitting on the couch and watching Netflix checks the rest box. You could also sit there

Katya: mm-hmm.

Georgie: With the kids in the room and you can all rest. And you also sort of had time. you think of quality time as like, we're conversing, we're doing a puzzle, we're doing a project together, but like even occupying the same space.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: This is nice. [00:25:00] You're fulfilling a role

Katya: okay. That's great. Thank you.

Georgie: Is there stuff that you do with your kids together?

Katya: Yeah, we love to go paddle boarding play outside, do puzzles read books. My, one of my kids has really had an interest in like cooking lately, so that has been kind of fun.

Now the baking area is still like a little bit of a struggle for me.

Georgie: Sure.

Katya: I don't trust myself fully yet around baked goods and like cookie dough and that sort of thing, but

Georgie: They're really tempting for a lot of people.

Katya: I want them to get to experience that. So we do still do it. I just, I think I've determined just not having any for me and just enjoying the time together baking and letting them eat the treats has felt a little bit better.

Georgie: Cool.

Katya: Yeah,

Georgie: you can also steer the project in directions that don't make it too hard for you. For example, let's say I, if I had kids and they were like, we wanna learn how to bake, and I'd be like, what do you think about learning how to roast a chicken? Like, [00:26:00] what do you think about

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Learning how to make vegetable soup. And they were like, no,

Katya: yeah,

Georgie: we only wanna bake. We only wanna make cookies.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: I'd be like, okay. How about white chocolate craisin cookies? Because I don't really like those, or

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Oatmeal raisin cookies or carrot spice cookies or ginger snaps. Because the wrong thing for me would be like, how about we make double chocolate chunk ones chocolate? That's exactly what I would want to eat. I'd be like, chocolate dough with chocolate chips. I'd have a very hard time.

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: Not eating them.

Katya: We have started a container garden together, which has been fun. And then we've been using what we've been growing to make some new recipes. So that has been cool.

Georgie: Cool.

Katya: And that's easier to moderate than chocolate chip cookie dough.

Georgie: Yeah. Yeah. So see if you can steer them towards flavors that you personally don't find super challenging when it comes to

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Cookies. Or quarter [00:27:00] the recipe and only make a small batch.

Katya: That's a good idea as well. Yes.

Georgie: Yeah. have some like mini cake recipes. I bought a mini cake tin.

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: And so I would find like a recipe online and I would just quarter it. And so I would only make one fourth of the recipe, which was enough for about four servings instead of 16. So my husband and I would eat it for dinner one night, have the seconds, a second night, and then it was gone.

Katya: That's a really smart idea. I have noticed when I started the coaching group, I was really struggling with cereal. And the idea of putting it in like baggies, like a single serving has been really helpful to me. And I feel excited because in the past I struggled with cereal and so I would either, have it all and binge on it and over eat or I just like wouldn't buy it at all and then not get to have it at all. But since I've been doing the baggies, I'll have like one baggie with my smoothie bowl [00:28:00] after my workout and it's great 'cause I get to enjoy the cereal, but the baggie sort of a buffer and it reminds me like, oh, this is how much I intended to have. I can have another baggie if I want, but I know that probably won't make me feel great. So

Georgie: yeah,

Katya: one bag is enough and I'll have another baggie tomorrow. So,

Georgie: totally. Yeah, you have to sort

Katya: of,

that's a hard thing.

Georgie: You think of it like this is a feel good amount. Like you know, this is a feel good amount of exercise. I feel invigorated, but I don't feel like I'm gonna puke. This is a feel good amount of cereal. This is a feel good frequency of smoothie bowl.

Katya: Yeah. Okay.

Georgie: So you feel positive when you're like, no, of course I could have more. I could also do a lot of things that would leave me feeling really icky. I'm not gonna choose to do those 'cause I don't wanna feel icky. So my feel good frequency, one a day,

Katya: feel good frequency, I, I might write that on a note card and put it in my pantry.

Georgie: There's a feel good frequency for everything. And sometimes we can recognize we're doing something more often than the feel good [00:29:00] frequency and then it feels less good.

Katya: I have felt good cutting out the second smoothie bowl. In my mind, I really, really want it because it's like part of my treat to myself and I look forward to it at the end of the day but from like a belly perspective, I do notice that I was probably not feeling as good as I could with that much volume. And I think that's something I'd, I'd like to grow in and do better in across the board just because I've gotten so used to, to eating and enjoying such large volumes. I think I've sort of been used to like eating until I'm full and a little bloated and have a little tummy pressure. I mean, not sick, but I think that was my normal, that was what almost felt normal, like the end of a meal. I didn't have the end of a meal signal until like I started getting bloated from having so many veggies and I've [00:30:00] realized that is silly, but that I didn't realize I was doing that. So yeah, that's an area I'd like to work on too.

Georgie: Yeah. So now you're paying more attention to not only how your body feels when you're eating, But I think hopefully, have you noticed any changes with getting more variety of food in, you know, we talked about getting like more variety of carbs in.

Katya: Yeah, I've been trying to add carbs at every meal and we talked recently about making sure I'm getting a good amount of fat too. And I think that has felt nice. I've had fun thinking of new things I might want to try. I think in the past I was eating sort of the same things almost out of fear just because it felt like safe.

That's kind of what I knew I had been eating and since I'm not tracking really anymore and I spent so many years tracking it felt safe to kind of have the same similar foods that I [00:31:00] have been having. But yeah, I'm slowly branching out.

Georgie: Good.

Katya: Slowly.

Georgie: Yeah, It's an anxiety avoiding, or like some people call it a safety behavior to like keep going to the same foods. The problem with when we do a lot of safety behaviors is that our world gets smaller and smaller and smaller and smaller.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: So we kind of wanna recognize that we don't have to do these things to say safe and free of anxiety and like that we're gonna be okay. It's not like all behaviors that we do for our safety are bad. Like putting on a seatbelt unequivocally a good idea. Putting on a bike helmet when you're biking always a good idea. But there when it comes to like limiting our food intake or not leaving the house for certain things, it's gotten too far.

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: So gradually stepping back and realizing like, okay, I can eat bread and everything's fine, is really powerful.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: And it's okay if you just start with like one slice of bread. It's okay if you start with [00:32:00] like a hundred grams of potato. You know, it's fine if you take baby steps. Just keep thinking about going in that direction.

Katya: Okay. I have been doing that and I'll keep practicing that. Thank you for the encouragement to step out of my comfort zone. I think I, it feels nice. I don't think I would do it on my own, so it feels nice to have somebody kinda holding my hand along the way.

Georgie: Yeah. And I imagine like you probably also have thoughts in your mind, like, I don't wanna turn around and be overweight.

Katya: Yeah. I'm at a healthy weight now, but I've spent years and years kind of being really careful about what I was eating. So in my mind, don't want to gain too much extra weight, but yeah.

Georgie: Yeah. I mean it's possible. I mean, we'll see what your body does, like from your photos. You look very thin, so it's possible that your body may want to be slightly more robust. [00:33:00] Strong.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: You're not gonna end up overweight at all.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: But like, sometimes if people are a little too thin for their biology, like they may come up slightly.

Katya: Sure. And I wanna be healthy and that is my main goal. I think like the number on the scale, it messes with my mind a little bit, but I've gotten like worlds better from what I was a few years ago. Even, like, the number on the scale would determine my joy or my peace for the day.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: And at the point I'm at now, I do feel like. I can just see it as a data point and you know, it waffles up and down and, it doesn't seem to bother me too much, but I do like to keep a little bit of an eye on it, I guess, just to make sure it's not, I dunno,

Georgie: skyrocketing

Katya: going too, too fast up.

Georgie: Yeah, I definitely understand that. For a long time I got on the scale every day because I was reassured that it wasn't shooting up, even though I was including more and more foods.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: So like, it can help to be like, [00:34:00] okay, I, I ate some bread. I'm, I'm pushing the, the envelope here, or I ate some real ice cream instead of diet ice cream. I had three french fries. Like, we make these little experiments and when you get on the scale and you see it's like pretty much the same, it really helps reassure like, those are all fine. It's okay.

Katya: I know you told me kind of your island belly in the bathtub story with your Vitamix

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: Protein ice cream last time. If you don't mind sharing, I was curious, like time-wise, how long did it take you to kinda go from island belly bathtub, veggie buckets to like your normal, healthy, balanced, confident eating now?

Georgie: So that episode itself was about 11 or 11 ish, 12 years ago. I just know because of the house I lived in, I've lived there for very long, so it's easy to put on the calendar.

[00:35:00] I'm like, yeah, that was, that was probably like 2012. And I think prior to that, the year between like 2011 and 2012. I had been counting calories for like the entirety of my adult life, including some of my adolescent life. So in 2011, I started really thinking hard that this wasn't what I wanted to do forever

Katya: mm-hmm.

Georgie: I had a body that everybody would say they wanted and I didn't wanna lose that.

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: Because it was like, this makes me feel good about myself. But at the same time, if I was honest, my life revolved around controlling my calories, getting to the gym for my workouts and no social event would interest me as much as like getting to the gym and controlling my food intake.

I wouldn't have gone on a date with anyone because I wouldn't have eaten a meal out. Like it was the project in my life. And I was like, I don't wanna be living my whole life focused around this.

Katya: Right.

Georgie: [00:36:00] So I really started to change just some of my dynamic in the world around 20 11, 20 12, trying to

Katya: okay.

Georgie: Have more, more trust in my appetite signals would do a decent enough job that it didn't have to count the calories and that I could

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Like actually just feel if I was hungry or not to make the call on whether I needed to eat or not.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: And try and feel when I had had enough food versus was still hungry and it was difficult but I did stop counting completely sometime in 2011 and I was still eating pretty frequently and possibly not letting myself get hungry. 'cause I was very much like, I don't wanna be hungry. I'm very afraid of getting hungry.

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: But I started with like five minutes. A day, can you just feel your appetite for five minutes a day? [00:37:00] And grudgingly, I started feeling it for like five minutes a day. And then I learned like, this is okay. You're all right.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: And then I started to add back in a lot of the foods that I had cut out.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: So that process has taken the entirety of the 10 years, like I'm still sort of getting more and more liberal with my intake.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: At first it was like I would only eat fat free cheese, and then I was like, I'll eat the low fat cheese, and now I just eat regular cheese. I don't worry about it.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: And I do eat some, I like Philadelphia light cream cheese, and I like the, the processed singles. I get the low fat ones there cause on eggs, they're just, I love them. I just love melted processed cheese on eggs, but, I also have like slices of regular cheese that I'll use on sandwiches or to make a quesadilla. So I, I gradually extended myself in areas like that. Like, okay, if we're out of Skimm milk, I'd buy the 1% [00:38:00] milk and not worry about it. I used to buy sugar-free jam and then one day I was like, I can't find it in this store. They don't appear to have sugar-free jam. I'm just gonna buy the regular jam. And you bet I thought about it, I was like, is this just a slippery slope to not caring about your health at all? Now you're buying regular jam?

And then I'm like, no, because I eat about one teaspoon of jam a week. Like, I don't even like jam all that frequently, but every now and then I want some jam.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: I've just bought regular jam and I've just bought regular jam ever since.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: I never particularly liked fried food, so that's probably the one thing I still just don't eat because I don't even like it.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: I've added back in like all the foods that I enjoy eating. Like I started eating pasta again, and I started eating pizza again. Like if I go to a restaurant, sometimes I'll order pizza. Sometimes I don't want a salad.

Katya: Okay. Yeah,

Georgie: I really like scones from this one bakery near here. So a lot [00:39:00] of times I like to go out and get a scone with my husband, and it might not happen for months at a time, but then like, I really want one, like I go get a scone where, you know, I think of me in like 2010 would've been like, I don't eat white flour. That's a no. That's a hard no. Like, absolutely not. And now I'm like, yeah, that's fine. I don't have a problem going out and doing that. And when I'm training, like I do training sessions with my team, and you sort of have to snack if you're gonna keep your energy up on like a three or a four hour workout. So

Katya: Right.

Georgie: I eat Nutrigrain bars 'cause they're cheap and they're tasty and they don't dry my mouth that terribly and like Yeah. They're completely processed. This is not a high nutrition food, but it's a great way to get carbohydrates in.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: And they're soft so I don't feel like I'm gonna choke on 'em. So I eat Nutrigrain bars during my workouts so that I have enough energy to finish the workout. 2010 Georgi would never have touched a Nutrigrain bar. I would've been like, that's way too much added sugar [00:40:00] processed, like No, no way at all. And the funny thing is, despite eating all of this wider variety

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Of food that I was eating.

Katya: Sure. Uhhuh,

Georgie: I have gained no fat. I am like

Katya: really? Okay.

Georgie: The same weight that I was then and I'm a lot stronger and have a lot more endurance.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: 'cause I'm like better fueled.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: So I can't give you like a timeline on there, but I'd say it was like one year of massive change to be like, I'm really not counting calories anymore. I'm really gonna trust,

Katya: yes,

Georgie: my appetite and satiety cues, but I was still very limited on the variety. I was still very much into, I hate to use the term clean eating, but it describes very well I was stuck in

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: The idea of only the healthiest foods.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: And then gradually it's been like 10 plus years of getting more liberal and more flexible and realizing that it doesn't make you fatter.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Your [00:41:00] appetite will,

Katya: thank you for sharing that. It's encouraging to feel like I can get there too. And also that like, I. It's okay if it takes me a while, 'cause

Georgie: yeah.

Katya: I feel like I'm slowly making progress, but it's very slow and so it's encouraging to hear that it took you a while too, and I don't wanna go back, so I'm just gonna keep moving forward.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: Even though it's small steps.

Georgie: Yeah. I feel like when we're doing this on our own volition, like this is our choice. We're doing this outta something we want, we gotta trust, like, I will keep taking small steps on my own time, but if somebody were to like, force me to eat these things, that would be super stressful borderline traumatizing, you know?

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: I disagree a lot with the way eating disorders are sometimes treated, especially in intensive outpatient or inpatient situations, you know?

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: They do things like sit a patient down with a burger and fries in front of them and tell them they can't leave until they eat it. [00:42:00] I'm like,

Katya: yeah,

Georgie: I can just imagine the distress that that would've caused me and that I ensure it causes people. And I think it's cruel,

Katya: right?

Georgie: Like I think you really should respect people's emotional state and let them take slow steps that feel safe. 'cause otherwise they just get out of treatment and they're like, now I can go back to what feels okay.

Katya: Yeah. I have felt since joining the, the coaching group, I, I just really appreciate the idea and thought like, I get to choose. And I feel like that makes me feel very comforted, I guess. I'm making the choice. I can choose either way, you know, but I, I wanna choose what's in line with my values and when I really think through that, you know, that is making these changes. But it feels good to be, Choosing. So, yeah.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: Anyway

Georgie: I also suggest when you're working on expanding your food intake, take tastes of everybody else's food if they'll share.

Katya: Oh, okay.

Georgie: Like, can I have one [00:43:00] of your m and ms, can I have a bite of your ice cream cone? Can I have a bite of your pizza? Like, take, bites of people's food because one you may have, like, I'll understand if you forgot some of the things that you like or you're not sure if you like them.

Katya: Yeah. I think I have forgotten things I like

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: Because I always order the same things and it's veggies and protein with a couple of croutons.

Georgie: Yeah. So it's perfectly good to like clean slate with all the foods in the universe and like, I'm gonna decide now which ones I wanna include. And for me, I was like, wow, I actually like bread. I actually like pasta. I still couldn't give an about rice. Take all the rice in the world, gimme the bread. But I had to like go taste all these foods and not think about the nutrient content to determine what I really and truly like.

Katya: Right.

Georgie: And I really love cheese and I really [00:44:00] don't care for french fries. It's fine. So you move in the directions.

Katya: That's a fun experiment.

Georgie: Yeah. So you move in the directions of the things that you find nutritious and tasty or even low nutrition and tasty. But like, you don't have to eat every food under the sun ever but it's nice to be able to eat a wider variety of things that we really enjoy and feel like it's safe for our bodies. 'cause our bodies really are perfectly good at navigating a very diverse diet. Yeah.

Katya: Great. Well I'm going to start tasting.

Georgie: Nice. Okay. So we're gonna start tasting. In terms of, I was thinking having a schedule for the day. I know your kids are out of school right now, right? So they're home a lot.

Katya: They go back to school in just like two weeks. So we're kind of wrapping up the end of summer and then it'll be them at school and me at home, I guess figuring out a new routine.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: So that would be different.

Georgie: Yeah, [00:45:00] definitely. Do you have a schedule or a calendar or anything like that that you use?

Katya: I do use a calendar. Mm-hmm.

Georgie: What kind of calendar? Paper? Online?

Katya: I use a, just Google Calendar, like on my phone.

Georgie: Same, I'm a Google Calendar acolyte. I love it. So it can be helpful to put stuff in there so that it has like a skeleton to your day, so for example.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Do you wake up at the same time every day?

Katya: I do. And since starting the group, I have been putting my meals and snacks in my Google calendar.

Georgie: Great!.

Katya: I know that sounds so silly, but

Georgie: No,

Katya: I just put a little fork and like a 30 minute event and I can move 'em up and down but I try to space 'em out like three or so hours according to the plans, you know, from the beginning, couple lessons. So I do have, I do have that in the calendar.

Georgie: That's excellent.

Katya: So maybe I'll add add like meditation or yoga [00:46:00] or something else.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: Into the day.

Georgie: So what are the times that you have in your Google calendar right now for meals or snacks, like planned eating times?

Katya: I wake up and have like a protein waffle usually for breakfast before my workout. And that's like somewhere in the six to seven o'clock spot.

Georgie: Okay.

Katya: And then I usually kind of spend some time with the kids, do a short workout at home and then have my post-workout snack, that's the smoothie bowl.

Georgie: Okay.

Katya: Usually between like nine and 10. And then have lunch sometime between 12 and one.

Georgie: What time is it in your calendar?

Katya: One o'clock.

Georgie: Okay. Now it's not important that you like Absolutely stick to that.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: I just wanna know what time it's in your calendar.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: 'cause that's how I'm thinking of the screen right now.

Katya: Yeah. So then I have one o'clock lunch and then I have [00:47:00] an afternoon snack at the three o'clock time.

Georgie: Okay.

Katya: That kind of gets moved around based on like what we have going on in the afternoon.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: And also I'm still struggling to figure out what afternoon snack I love, but

Georgie: yeah,

Katya: we talked about that and I have some ideas.

Georgie: You'll figure it out.

Katya: And then we usually have dinner around six.

Georgie: Okay. And has it been working for you to not eat after dinner?

Katya: It has, I've been doing the hot cocoa or making a mug cake as like my dinner dessert sweet, but then after that I'm done.

Georgie: Great. Cool. Okay.

Katya: And I feel good with that, so that has been nice.

Georgie: Oh, I'm really happy. Give yourself lots of credit for that. That's nice. So you wake up, you have your breakfast. The workout takes the space between your breakfast and your post-workout snack.

Katya: Yeah. My workout's kind of short. It's usually like 30, 40 minutes, but in between that I'm getting the kids' breakfast and kind of doing some stuff from the house and that sort of thing.

Georgie: Okay. Workout slash kids' breakfast and house stuff. [00:48:00] The way I'm thinking about this is that like, so in our day we have sort of like appointments with our meals and then we have spaces, and this is like the free period in high school. Like you get to pick what you're gonna do in the spaces. So

Katya: okay.

Georgie: Between the waffle and the post-workout smoothie bowl, you have a space. So we could think of that as like space one. Right now you already have stuff that fills space One your workout.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Kids breakfast, the house stuff. But then we've also got space two, which would be post-workout, snack to lunch.

Katya: Right.

Georgie: So somewhere around nine to one or 10 to one or 12. Yes. So we'll call that space two. Space one's already occupied. Space three is gonna be between lunch and afternoon snack.

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: Space four. Afternoon snack and dinner. And then space five is after dinner. And you've already kind of, you're doing well with space five already. You've got some after dinner stuff going. Your gratitude [00:49:00] journal, your walk.

Katya: Yeah. Yeah. Cool.

Georgie: So space one is Space five already solved? Okay. Down to four.

Katya: Yay.

Georgie: So now what you've got here is places you can try plugging in different things. So when you think about your day, you could be. What do I need to get done today?

I need groceries. I need to take something to the post office. I need to pick up prescriptions. That'll probably take a couple hours. That'll fill a space. You know, all of these spaces are gonna be two to three hours long.

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: Yeah. Three to six. Yeah. Basically we got two or three chunks. Two or three hour chunks.

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: So you like my formula here, right? Space is 1, 2, 4. Yeah. Are two to three hour chunks. So that could be, I think errands would be a perfect one there. Like if I had errands, I'd plug that in.

Katya: Do that. Sure.

Georgie: Do all my errands. So if you had a day where you needed to do errands, find which slot you wanna plug that in?

Katya: Which space? Yeah.

Georgie: And now you've got three. Now you're down to three.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: So you could make [00:50:00] plans to see a friend. That might be a, a chunk there. Plan to see a friend. It could be housework. Laundry. It never ends, right?

Katya: Right.

Georgie: Housework, laundry. You could plug in there. It could be rest. I know two to three hours may sound like, oh my god, that's a lot of rest, Georgie.

But you could combine it with other stuff that you need to do, like say shower or wash hair.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: So like shower, wash, hair, rest might be enough things I would put in a two or three hour block. It could be. What else? What else do you fill your day with?

Katya: Well right now with the kids' home, it's kind of been kid activities, but when they go back to school I like to do like a bible study, I like to take like a walk with a friend, play tennis, I guess there are a lot of things I could fill that time with.

Georgie: We talked about maybe doing something creative, like [00:51:00] writing blog articles.

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: Or you know, stuff to help, you know, the audience. Like you said, you really like helping moms who are struggling with that problem of fitting fitness in with their busy lives.

Katya: Yeah. Yeah.

Georgie: So, yeah, I think writing stuff can be, it can feel really good to help people out.

Katya: Yes. Okay.

Georgie: So maybe writing. Do you have a Facebook page?

Katya: I do. I don't really use it.

Georgie: It's never too late to start it back up. And I always tell people, if you take a break from social media and you come back, no one needs to know where you went.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Don't worry about saying anything. I just say show up and be like, I'm really excited about what I'm working on. Now here's a, okay, here's an article on this. Like no one needs to know where you've been.

Katya: Okay. That's helpful. Thank you.

Georgie: So yeah, so writing some like thought out posts for your Facebook page. Can help it get shared more. You know, I think of like

Katya: yeah.

Georgie: Value laden posts as being like a mini article.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: And you [00:52:00] record content, you said like videos and like workout videos?

Katya: I do some personal training, like in person ladies and I do really enjoy that as well. So,

Georgie: yeah. So that's another thing you might plug in there, like if you're gonna go somewhere and see a client or two, that might fill up a two or three hour block.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: So I put writing Facebook posts slash recording content because you could find that people really like videos. So you could share a video on your Facebook page.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Of like, this is an exercise you can do if you own no exercise equipment.

Katya: Right.

Georgie: Stuff like that.

Katya: That's a great idea.

Georgie: So yeah, recording some content that you can share be a fun one. Bible study is a good one. I like that one because you've got variety between exercise and exertion stuff, and then some stationary stuff like Bible study or reading or gratitude, journaling. You know, these are more like the body gets to rest there because like tennis and walking and yoga and all that are great, but [00:53:00]

Katya: Right.

Georgie: If you try and book active things for all of the blocks in your day, you're gonna be exhausted.

Katya: Yes. That makes sense. I will look for spaces to plug myself in, as we said.

Georgie: Cool. And if you have something that's only gonna take an hour, like let's say you have like a personal training client and they're next door, so you don't have to drive far. You're like, that's an hour.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: What else can I fit in? And you might find there's other small things you can plan. And you can always, it's okay to just like leave spaces too.

Katya: Yes. A little margin I think is probably helpful for me.

Georgie: Yeah. You don't want to go in where you're like, oh, at 8 52 I'm doing this and at 8 54 I'm gonna go to the bathroom and then by 8 59 I'm gonna be in the car so I can be on the road till nine 12.

Katya: Yeah,

Georgie: you don't wanna run your life that way. Right. So we just want enough structure that you're not sitting there with hours between you and the next time you're eating, going, I'm just looking forward to the food.

Katya: Yes. That makes so much sense. And that's really helpful. Thank you for helping me think through all of that.

Georgie: No trouble. No [00:54:00] trouble. And if you ever find in the future that you wanna fiddle with the eating schedule.

Katya: Mm-hmm.

Georgie: Like sometimes people feel like they wanna do larger meals and not so many snacks, then you can always rejigger it. Like I generally have like breakfast, lunch if somebody's like just doing breakfast, lunch, dinner.

Then they really just have fewer blocks. They have breakfast to lunch, lunch to dinner, and then dinner to bedtime. So it's like a hockey game.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: You have three periods

Katya: I think down the road I might want to do that. I've been trying to use the more frequent eating, like because of what we learned with the lesson, to have a little bit less time in between the meals but as I've been paying attention to my fullness I have actually come to enjoy feeling like a little bit hungry before my next time to eat.

Georgie: Yeah.

Katya: So I think maybe down the road that might be something I could work on adjusting. So

Georgie: yeah,

Katya: I can [00:55:00] get a little more space in between so I can really feel that hunger.

Georgie: Mm-hmm. Yeah. And again, like zero hurry there. You already just recently made the change to take out after dinner snacks,

Katya: right. So, and that's progress. So I'm very happy for that.

Georgie: No hurry needed. No hurry needed. So so do you think you can work on your calendar for, you know, the next couple of days and just practice plugging in some ideas for things to try?

Katya: Yeah, I'm actually, I'm like really excited about, you're like,

Georgie: let add it. I'm wanna organize,

Katya: let me, yeah. Let me color code it. And I, I think I do have some good ideas and I appreciate you kind of helping me think through the spaces that does feel, less overwhelming.

Georgie: Yeah,

Katya: to think of it that way.

Georgie: Yeah, I know , it can feel silly to be like, I don't know how to have fun. I don't know what foods I like. I dunno how like, but that's how it ends up for people. Like, that's how it ended up for me. That's how it ends up for a lot of the people that I work with. They're like, okay, [00:56:00] so have fun.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: Where, where do I get it?

Like, where do I go?

Katya: Yeah, right.

Georgie: To get fun. It's like we kind of gotta try a bunch of stuff and some stuff might stick and some stuff might not. Yeah.

Katya: I, I appreciate that. I feel like it helps me to, to have like an idea and list and I'll try things and then evaluate them and see what I love and go from there. And I'm excited to try the meditation thing that you sent me too. Thank you for sending that.

Georgie: No trouble. I'm excited for you to try it too. Don't be afraid to purchase things if you think there might be a new activity that you wanna try. Like, and I'm not talking like spend all your money on craft supplies, but like I've had clients that were like, I got a coloring book and I really like doing it. I happened to have bought coloring books and never used any of them.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: But I bought paint by numbers. Loved it.

Katya: Ah, okay.

Georgie: You never know what's gonna be the thing that you wanna do. [00:57:00]

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: I think I just get frustrated with colored pencils and like they wear down and you go sharpen on. I'm like, it just wasn't working for me.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: So, but I love having my little row of all the different paints and your numbers and like, if you're like a numbers person, you're like, okay, I've got, you know, little plot number three and my little tiny brush and I'm gonna put in all the spots with the number three. And like, they're very detailed and I like detailed small things.

Katya: Yeah.

Georgie: So for 20 or 30 bucks, I bought some, like paint my numbers for adults kit.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: And I had a blast with it. I bought another one, another one, and I was like, who knew I had an artistic streak, so yes, I definitely recommend a search for paint by numbers for adults.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: Wooden jigsaw puzzles are also really good.

Katya: Oh, okay.

Georgie: There's some really pretty ones

Katya: I will add that to my list.

Georgie: And for some reason the wooden pieces just feel nice. so you have to try some stuff and not everything works. Like I did crochet for a little while and then I was like, no, wasn't doing it for me.

Katya: Okay.

Georgie: I tried playing chess with my husband possibly [00:58:00] because he's just too good and I was losing over and over and over. It wasn't fun.

But yeah, like if you've been a runner, sometimes people like getting a bike, peddling their bike around or getting on roller skates with the kids, or visiting the library, going to see a movie. I booked tickets to puppy yoga over the weekend. I'm not sure if you saw that.

Katya: I know, I saw your picture and it looked really cute.

Georgie: So fun. They basically teach a yoga class with like puppies just free roaming. So all the people are like doing their yoga poses and the puppies are like going up and sniffing them and so

Katya: it gives like a whole new meeting to down dog.

Georgie: Yeah. Yeah. I was doing downward dog and this puppy like grabs my braid like, I love tug of war. So like, yeah, just finding some new stuff to go do. You can plug it into your calendar. So when look at your next few days and you're like, I have so much fullness and like excitement and time with people I love in my life.

Katya: Yeah,

Georgie: it's so much easier to let food sort of like settle back down to just being

Katya: Yes.

Georgie: An additional joy.

Katya: That makes so [00:59:00] much sense and I really think that's gonna be helpful. So I'm gonna start that on my calendar tomorrow. Cool.

Georgie: All right. I look forward to updates on how all of this goes. You're doing great work. You're doing really, really great work.

Katya: Thank you so much and thanks again for all your help. I am just so grateful and really appreciate it.

Georgie: My pleasure. I love my job. I love what I get to do, so thank you. Talk to you soon.

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Georgie: Many people I work with would nod their heads in agreement with Katya. That life can sometimes feel like it doesn't have any pleasure or fun in it, especially when you have kids and you've been really focused on raising them and making sure they're busy and engaged. But I want to acknowledge it's really hard to find activities that we truly enjoy, and it's absolutely essential for happiness.

Other people can suggest hobbies, add infinitum, like knitting or pickleball, woodworking, [01:00:00] drawing, tap dancing, reading, cycling, vacation planning, movies with friends, or following a sports team. But in the end, you just have to try stuff and see what feels good to you. Fun can be found in thousands of different places.

If you need a place to start, here are a few ideas. One, think of the people you know who do some sport or hobby you think you might be up to try. Ask them. Can I come paddle with you sometime? I know you go to a yoga studio. Can I try a class with you sometime? Can you teach me how you grow tomatoes? Yours are so amazing.

I have a mountain bike, but I don't really know how to mountain bike. Can you show me a trail? Second, browse a store for books, eBooks, or audiobooks. See what you like. Try a mystery, a fantasy, a romance novel biography, or anything that gets your interest. I happen to love sports and adventure stories. I might not ever go climb in the [01:01:00] Himalayas or be in the Olympics, but I really enjoy reading accounts from people who have had those experiences.

Go to an arts and craft store, walk in and just look around. You might get some ideas. If you don't feel like leaving your house, no problem. Search on Instagram or Pinterest, or just about any social media site for hashtag craft ideas. Again, these are just some starting points. If you don't try new things, you never know.

Katya and I also spoke in this episode about how to gradually expand her food options. If you've cut out many foods slowly over time because you fear they will cause weight gain, it's important to go slowly and gently as you experiment reintroducing these foods. One food experience at a time can help you build confidence, see that they do not cause weight gain, and begin to see all foods as safe and perfectly acceptable to eat.

Remember, if you're eating when you're hungry and you're stopping when you're full, your body is going to do a [01:02:00] lot of the work of managing your calorie intake for you. What that means is that it's perfectly okay to include foods like bread, potatoes, steak, or french fries that are commonly maligned and pointed to as bad foods that you must not have.

I hope you're enjoying the new show. Leave us some stars or share a review if you are. Until next time, I'm Georgie Fear and together with the staff of Confident Eaters, we wish you a very happy, well-Fed Day.